Hello everybody, and welcome back to If I'm Honest with Julia Landauer. Today's guest came as a result of a DM that I sent, and I'm so excited to have Selena Coppock on the show today. Selena is a former standup comedian and current writer and podcaster based in New York City. She's the creator and voice of @nytvows, which is a parody Twitter X and Instagram account that lampoons a New York Times wedding section, the wedding industrial complex, wasps, and so much more. Her years of cracking wise in that account landed her a 2024 nuptials in the actual vows section. She is a creator and host of Two Wick Minimum, America's favorite and only podcast about candles. Yes, it's for real. And she is the former co-host of Betche's Brides, a podcast where she and her bestie, Chelsea, would dish and discuss all things matrimonial as she was planning her wedding. You can listen to her debut stand-up album, Seen Better Days, which is Little Lamb Recordings, on Spotify, iTunes, or wherever you get your albums, and it hit number one on the iTunes comedy chart, and you're going to love it. Selena was also a guest star on the sitcom Red Oaks on Amazon Prime Video, and worked as a creative consultant on Younger, which was on TV land. I was introduced to Selena through NYT Vows, and found her quick wick and snarkiness at some of the kind of cultural things that were happening in the times to be so funny, and just clearly so smart. And as I dug into her more, and saw all the different avenues that she then built her career based on her stand-up comedy days, was really inspirational and really admirable. And I was so excited to have this conversation with her. We talk about how she approached all the different facets of what she does, we talk about some of the things that were really challenging, we talk about things that she was sure we're gonna work out, and then they didn't work out, and they led her to something else. And we talk about everything from young comics now and content creators, and how the landscape has changed. She was really, really vulnerable and insightful with a lot of firsthand experience that she generously shared with us. And I highly encourage you to check out her album, which is Her Pride and Joy. So I hope you enjoy this discussion with Selena Coppock. Selena, thank you so much for joining me on If I'm Honest. I'm so excited to be here, Julia. As I said in the intro, like I've been following you for years, and so when I moved back to New York, it was a goal of mine from before I moved back here to connect with you. So this is just a dream come true. So thank you. I am so honored. Honestly, writing little jokes on the internet is so much fun, and it's introduced me to so many wonderful people. The internet has a lot of terrible places, but a lot of really wonderful places. That's true. Yeah, so how are you doing this week? I'm doing well. I'm excited. Summer in the city is my favorite, and I usually stay here in New York in the summer and go to the beach at Coney Island, and so I'm just thrilled that it's getting warmer. Yeah, I maybe I missed some of our spring with travel, but I feel like spring was very short. Yeah, it really was. There was very little like open window period. I agree, I agree. It's felt like kind of, yeah, I know. Yeah, well, that sounds like an amazing summer, and I kind of forgot about Coney Island, so I'm gonna have to take my husband for the first time, because I don't think he's ever been. It's a great, a lot of people never go. It's like all you got to do is stay on the subway all the way, and then you get dumped out into this like wackadoom wonderland. I mean, it's really fun. There's the beach, there's, you know, rides to ride, good food to eat, clams. It's just a lot of fun. I definitely went on a date in high school out to Coney Island, and I'm just not remembering. You're a New York native, I'm from New York. Yeah, I went to Stuy and grew up here, and yeah, I definitely had a date on Coney Island. Yeah, that's cute. Yeah, so you are such a multi-hyphenate. I want to make sure I get everything. You're a former stand-up comedian, writer, podcaster, content creator. What would you say is like the core string that connects all of those things that you do, I think it's two things, it is fun and it's connection, and, and I, because I do feel like, you know, there's.. I always often go back to this one saying from Victor Borg, I think, if I'm pronouncing it right, which is, laughter is the shortest distance between two people. Oh, I love that, I really love that, and I truly feel that way. And when I was doing stand-up, I felt I really felt like it was just so important to connect with people, but also to give people a fun experience. And you know, I mean, when I, you know, I started doing stand-up, actually in Boston, where I grew up, and then moved to New York. I moved to New York in 2006 and you know, was doing awful open mics in like dumpy places, where it would literally rain through the ceiling, and you know, but then also doing other, you know, everything from that to like a great show at a, you know, traditional club or a great show at an alternative venue, and I always took it very seriously that, like, the people in the audience, they are spending their night here with us, and maybe they got a babysitter for the kids, and maybe they, you know, had to ride a long train ride or get parking, and they're doing a two drink minimum, and so we are here to give them a fun night. And I really felt like I'm the tour guide on this journey and this experience, and you know, some people I came up with, they love to do stand up and, you know, get really pulled. Political and dig in or talk about really upsetting topics, and my style is always just like, nope, let's keep it fun, you know, like people come here to escape from the horrors of, you know, of real reality, or things are going through, or you know, geopolitical landscape, and I really think it's so important that we have fun, and so that's often been a through line of a lot of my creative endeavors, because I just sort of don't take it that seriously, like I'm just here to have a good time, and you know, I have this silly podcast about candles that's like, so it's called Two Wick Minimum, it's like I just interview people talking about literally how they feel about candles, and you know, which is just like it's so silly, it's really light, and it's for everyone, like it could run the political, you know, gamut of you don't have to agree with me politically to appreciate a good candle, right, and I kind of, you know, I sort of like that, that I just, I want everyone to feel connected and to just have a good time. Well, and I think that that's so, like, so critical right now too, when we're like everything is so polarizing, and so, and I think you're seeing so much less of that in spaces, and so, thank you on behalf of whoever, that for, for, for doing that, because I think it's so important. But was there a time when you were young that you realized that, like, fun and connection piece was really important? It took a little while, because I think you know, first I was doing improv, and then I got into stand-up, and I, you know, you can't sometimes get thrust into a thing you don't quite know what it is you're looking for, or you think, oh, everyone is everyone's goal here is to have for com is to, I used to feel as though I assume everyone's goal is to just be a comedian and have comedy pay for your life, and that was sort of how I was acting for a couple years, and then I remember this wonderful comedian, Jerry Logan, who's so funny, he lives in LA now, you know, he said to me one time, just randomly waiting to go on stage, he's like, well, you know, like it's that's kind of such a rarity, and so there's other goals out of this thing, and there's other ways to feel as though you'd succeeded, and it really struck me, and that I stumbled upon this book, Big Magic by Elizabeth Gilbert, which I love that book so much. It's so brilliant, and it's just about how everyone can be creative, and in it she talks about how if you demand that your art pay for your life, you will resent your art. And so that's why I've always kept a nine to five job that thankfully I get some flexibility, but just because I need to make, I can only be creative, I can only be relaxed enough to create and write jokes and put on shows and have ideas if I know every two weeks the paycheck is going to hit, right? I have insurance, I can pay my rent, you know. Yeah, no, that's really it's really great, I think, to kind of get that perspective from someone kind of earlier on in your career, because as you were saying that, like in tying it back to myself and racing, it kind of reminds me of something that someone else had said on the platform, a fellow racer, about how he'd love to be like a full-time amateur or an enthusiast, in that you can still work as hard, you can still push as hard, train as hard, whatever it is, or you know, create as, as prolifically, but if you're not dependent on that paycheck, it doesn't feel like either you're going to burn out or that you are not going to make it. And I think that even with my own career, like, I definitely wanted to be a big superstar racer, and, like, you know, make a bunch of money from it, and people would ask me, like, what do you consider successful, and I, for a long time, my answer was always to get paid to go race cars, like that would be successful, and I didn't quite get there right, and so, like, got sponsorship for it, but wasn't paid by a racing team to be a racer, which very few people are, but you talked about resenting, and there's definitely some of that, so that's it's I think it's a gift to kind of have that perspective early on, yes, completely, because it's many people sort of never do, and then they're always chasing the dragon of this thing, and they never make peace with, like, the whole experience is the thing you're missing, it, man, you know, like, it's, you know, the whole, like, I remember my high school director used to say, like, the measure of your life is your life, like, all of this is just meant to be enjoyed, and, and, yeah, if you're only obsessed with, you know, I'm a failure unless I get this one thing, you know, you're missing out on, yeah, all of the, all of the internal wins you're getting, you know, and exciting opportunities and people you're connecting with, and yeah, it's just good to enjoy the ride, totally. So, you've also dabbled in acting, how long did you pursue that? Like, what made you take that jump? Well, so I did theater in, like, high school, and in college I was on the improv, in the improv troupe, and sang, and I was, I was actually everything. Oh my gosh, my 20s and 30s, I was, I did, yeah, I did a little bit of everything, like high school, I did theater and field hockey, college, wrote for the newspaper in a sorority. My senior year, I was the president of the Hamiltone's a cappella group at Hamilton College. It's like, so a cappella group names, so much word play that I know, it's so cordy. I love it. So I was always very comfortable acting, and then I was doing improv after college. I moved to Chicago and did classes at Improv Olympic IO, I. And then moved back to home to Boston, and did a lot of improv there, so you know, I never consider myself like an actor, because I really respect true, classically trained actors, you know, like my cousin went to Julia, I admire that so much, that's a whole like different ballgame, but when it comes to comedic roles, I feel like, oh, I could do it, you know, so it was really fun, that TV show, Red Oaks, which was one of Amazon Prime's first sitcoms, it filmed here in New York, which was so wonderful, so cool, and their casting people were fantastic, and they just really like were around knowing who's who in comedy, and so they reached out to a ton of comedians for all different opportunities, and and then the one that I got, which was sort of perfect, it was just this very trashy role, and like, I was just like, 'Yo, I can do trash. I know, and I really.. and I was so proud that I got that, because I didn't have an agent or a manager. That's huge. I know it was so.. it was really.. I was so proud of myself, because I went.. you know, when you're in.. we're waiting for the audition, and there's.. there's other women I know, and they're all wrapped by like three arts and CAA, and like big names, and I was just like, but I just had, you know, I had confidence in myself, because I know, like, I usually, my hair is much more blonde, I wore these big hoops, I had like a pink dress on, I was just like, I know how to do this right, and I was so proud, I got that, and then on set it was just, it was so wonderful and exciting, and I again felt like I know how to do a comedic role. I would never think I could be a female lead, you know? Like, I haven't studied it, but you need someone to be kind of a trashy character, like, nailed it, and you're the one, exactly. Got it. Amazing. Well, and I like that you say that, because in some other conversations I've had, we've talked about how, like, when you're starting off, starting out, like, with the specific craft that you're trying to pursue, like, and you're an entrepreneurial pursuit, like, you'll take anything, do anything, like, you'll figure out how to fit a role, and I really like that you kind of knew that lane that was so that you were so perfect for, and then really leaning into that and being intentional with that, because to your point, it like was successful and worked right away, and it was nice because I had auditioned for a different role that I didn't get, and I was wasn't surprised. I felt like the audition didn't go well, but then they remembered me for this other role, which I thought was such a testament to my look. Maybe you know, I was like, oh, you need blonde trash and ring a ding, you know. So was that had you done a lot of auditions, or was it really the select few for these specific comedic roles? Select few, yeah. I'm not. I would, because my sister is a very successful commercial actress. She, bless her heart, got me her representation in LA, has a New York office, of course. So they sort of, as a favor to her, were willing to rep me and send me out on stuff, and I was just terrible at it. I just.. I'm very.. because with commercial acting, you need real, like the smallest look to change everything, you know? Like, you don't need to be big, yeah. And I'm just used to always playing big, because I'm playing comedy clubs, and you're selling it to the back of the room, right? You know, so I was terrible at these commercial auditions, but you know, I appreciated that they gave me a chance. Yeah, and you know, and it gave me an understanding of just the how things work in the audition, and what you know, like even the to learn the names of, like, okay, these are the sides, this is how you sign up, this is how you slate, just to know that kind of stuff was great. Yeah, and to learn that lingo, and something that I read you said was that that acting was a lot of fun, and obviously like great roles for you, but you also mentioned that one of the elements that maybe wasn't your favorite, and correct me if I'm wrong, but that you know when you're auditioning for a role, it's usually someone else's script with someone else directing it and someone else's vision, so there's a lot that's out of your control, and is that a fairness completely? Yeah, and I love that, because I think that kind of taking ownership of your life and taking what control you can is the first step for anything, for a career, for relationships, for self-betterment. So, can you share more about how that mindset kind of led to how you're approaching your career from from like day one to now. Totally, I love that. It's because indeed there are so many gatekeepers, and especially I found that, you know, auditioning, or similarly back when I did improv, before I did stand up, it's so many gatekeepers of like, you know, enroll in our classes, and there's five levels of classes, and you have to pay for them, and maybe there's a waiting list to even get in the class, and then you audition for a team, and an improv, in particular. I feel like there's a lot of sort of lousy characters who you know want to be in charge and run the auditions, and so that's sort of what pushed me into stand-up, because I love that you can do it yourself if you want to run a show. I used to run a show at a bar on Avenue B, where it did rain through the ceiling, but it was when I was young in stand-up, and I was like, I just want to know how to run a weekly show, so I would run a show every single Wednesday night, and you know, I was booking five to seven comedians per week, so I was meeting a million people, and then people visiting from other cities wouldn't hear that I have a steady Wednesday show. So reach out to Selena, so then I was connecting with all of these people, and I was making it happen myself, you know. I'm such a.. I totally agree, you really got to make your own breaks, and if all you're doing is auditioning for other people's things or submitting for other people's projects, I just think it's.. yeah, it's such a shame because you really are limiting yourself, and there's so much that you can do if you sort of DIY it, and you learn so much from doing it that way too. Yeah, so when you kind of, I don't think it was necessarily a specific point in time, but whenever you decided, like, okay, yes, we're gonna kind of move away from acting or just focus on stand-up, what was your initial roadmap for how you were going to build your career, or was it kind of you did one thing and then learned how it could evolve, or like pick up cues? Like, what did that evolution or initial start look like? I didn't really know much. I knew, I mean, thankfully the Boston comedy scene is lovely and good, like it's a really good place to cut your teeth, you know that Boston comedy scene, shout out Boston. I know it's such a great scene, and, and there were a couple clubs, and you know, you can do some cerebral comedy in Boston, it's like smart audiences. So it was a really nice place to start, but I kind of didn't know what I was going to do, and I was very fortunate in that about two years into me doing stand-up in Boston, I got laid off from a job in Boston, and my boss at the time was like, you know, Selina, you work, you know, your nine to five is publishing, and you do stand-up at night, like, why are you not in New York? And I just, I felt like that layoff was actually such a blessing, because it gave me a moment to take a beat and be like, wait, I don't need, what should I do? You know, do I want to pivot? Do I want to go somewhere else? And then, and I'm a big believer that the universe will open doors when it's the right fit. So then my uncle Jimmy had an apartment on the Upper East Side, and he was like, "Hey, you can live in the guest room. Ah, would you love rent or low free or low rent? Free. You love free housing. Fresh Prince of Bel Air, like I was just like, no way, I'm moving to 66 and Lex, you know, I mean, okay, yeah, exactly, I know, moving on up, it was great, but you know, and then then I was able to do some freelance work when I first got here, and then I worked at Barnes and Noble Corporate, which was one, like, all these things were flowing so easily, you know, and and then when I got to New York, that's where you know you could do stand-up every night, multiple times a night, yeah. And so then it really improves your stand-up so quickly, because you're grinding every night, and you can be working out material all the time, and doing a mic, and then a show, and then a late-night mic. So then the pathway kind of revealed itself, but I didn't know sort of what I was going to do, or I didn't know also all the other offshoots that I could do, right? You know, I mean, podcasting didn't exist, you know. And so, and so, then you know, and then that became, you know, and that developed, or you know, my friends and I would make videos, and we'd put them on Funny or Die, or, you know, and, oh, that's so funny on Myspace. Like, we have a bunch of really good videos, and I'm so furious because they're like trapped on Myspace, you know. But, but, you know, I mean, you're just, you're responding as things are unfolding, yeah. And I felt very lucky, you know, I, because I had a nine to five, money was coming in. You know, I signed up for classes at Upright Citizens Brigade, and did a lot of storytelling, and would go to the Moth Story Slams all the time. You know, I just really immersed myself in meeting people, building community, learning as much as I could learn, and really being in the scene. Yeah, totally. So you had mentioned, like, the importance of keeping that nine to five, and I think that that's probably like there are probably two camps when it comes to creatives and nine to fives. Like, I know plenty of like motorsports content creators where their nine to five is completely separate from their content that they're creating, and it's definitely like just separate worlds. Have you found that your nine to five in any way helps these other creative professional pursuits that you've had, and vice versa? I think in some ways it does, because this is so funny. Years ago, the TV show Younger, I did punch ups on four episodes. What does punch up mean for those who are not initiated? Yes, yes, yeah. Punch-ups is just so the script gets written by the writers who are in the union, WGA Writers Guild of America East, but they write the script, and then they'll usually send it out to a few comedians, and the comedians are encouraged to just slightly tinker, don't you know, like don't reread the script, and don't change what's happening, but can you add in jokes? Got it? And so you're encouraged to add in as many jokes as you can. It's real, it's such a fun, it's a really fun task. I remember, but I was, it was so.. I was so lucky I had that opportunity, because Eliot Glazer, Ilana Glazer's brother, who I'm like old friends with them through the comedy scene, he was working on Younger, and he knew I worked in publishing, and he was like, 'Oh my gosh, we're doing a TV show about publishing, so I want.. I thought of you. There we go. It was so cool, you know. And they just sent me.. they're like, 'Here's the first two episodes that I did inserted jokes, and then they're like, 'Here's two more, you know? I mean, it was so neat, but.. but so it was good that people knew I was in publishing, yeah. Know, but then I mean, there can be some drawbacks. I know when I was at Barnes and Noble Corporate, that was, you know, my first year in New York, and they really didn't like that I did stand up, and I thought it was really unfair, because everyone has a life outside of work. How did they bring that up, if you don't mind my asking? I think I was young, and I think I was sort of in.. if I had to do again, I never would have revealed that I did stand up to those people, and that was that at a time when, like, social media wasn't like super big, exactly. Your houses call you, or whatever, I could have kept this as a secret, you know. I didn't have a website, you know, like, but I think, you know, I was just sort of excited and proud, like I moved to New York, and I have a job in publishing, and I do stand-up at night, and so these women, who worked, a lot of them who worked at Barnes and Noble, they would just sort of make remarks of like, oh, you've got to run off, you have a show, right? Oh, yeah, and I just thought, you know, people might be running off to pick their kid up from soccer, and you think that's okay, but because I'm leaving to go do a show, like, yeah, you know, it just felt like a double standard, so that it did teach me, like, oh, there are times where people don't need to know everything you're doing, I think that's a really important lesson, which I think a lot of people probably learn in corporate, but yeah, that not everyone needs the whole truth all the time, exactly, or even everything you're doing, you know, like I, you know, I love chatting with people at bars, and, but you know, I've sometimes I'll just almost reveal to more than, and I'm like, I don't need to give you my resume. What am I doing? You know, no, totally, I get that. And there are even times, like, I don't know if you feel this, but like, there's sometimes we're just like not in the mood to get into what you do. Like, there are times when I'm not trying to tell anyone that I'm a race car driver, was a race car driver. So, you must be so exhausted by all the follow-up questions that you can see coming a mile away, you know, I don't know, like, you don't know what enthusiasm level people might have, or what experience people might have, and maybe there's, maybe I'm projecting, maybe a little for performers, but like, if someone had a bad experience with a comedian who happened to be blonde one time, like, what does that then lead? So it's just like, you gotta, you gotta be careful. I totally agree. Yeah, I agree, and you know there's nothing wrong with holding, like revealing yourself slowly. Yeah, and it gives you, gives you levels and layers that you can work through eventually. And yeah, no, I get that. We're gonna take a quick break, and we'll be right back, I We're back on If I'm Honest with Julia Landauer, so I discovered you many years ago now on your account, NYTVows slash The Fake Grey Lady, which is a parody account for the New York Times vows, and I read the vows section and the mini vows and all the fun stuff, and especially after after college, I think when some of my classmates from high school and college started getting married, I would see occasionally people that I knew in the section. So I found you that way, and you've grown that into such a big and impressive account. And just talk to me about how that got started, how you grew it, because now you were featured in the New York Times section. Yeah, all I had to do to get in the section was make fun of them for roughly a decade, whatever works. I know, yeah, like it's a long game, man. But yeah, I started it. I want to say I started it around 2014 Okay, that's when I graduated college. Okay, yeah. I mean, I've been at it a while now, but yeah, I mean, I've been reading the section since I was 12, because I'm a little weirdo, and because when I was a kid, my parents, so many girls did, especially girls like it was featured in so many movies, I feel like, like, it was, you wanted to get in the vast, oh yeah, it's like a cultural touchstone, I mean, I remember I'm the youngest of three, and my mom saying, and because, you know, back, it used to be, you know, my mom was in it for my parents' marriage, which was 53 years ago. You know, because my mom went to, you know, my mom, you know, she was in the social register, her family, and she went to Nightingale-Bamford, you know. And, you know, so, so, but when I, we were getting older, my mom would always joke around that, like, my oldest sister, Emily, wouldn't get in, because she went to college in Maine, and then my middle sister wouldn't get in, because she went to college in Maine, also, but I went to college in New York State, in Hamilton, so she's like, "You're my only hope, Selena, you know, which, oh, that's funny, so funny, and you know, and it all worked out beautifully, but, but, yeah, I mean, the section has shifted so much from what it was when I was 12, you know, when I was young, reading it, and I was always just so struck by the sort of obsession with wasp culture and Mayflower and Ivy Leagues and private clubs, and you know, in reading it when I was young, I didn't know what any of these things really were, but my mom is from the Upper East Side, and we used to go to the Hamptons, starting in the summer, so I knew some of them, I knew, like, oh, the Maidstone Club, I've been there, my Aunt Kate, yeah, just like you're reading it, and like getting the culture, I know sometimes I would get cultural references. I was like, oh, wow, you know. So, then, yeah, so living in New York, it was, you know, when I felt like it was still that very much that voice of an old grande dame, and I just felt like, why is no one making fun of this yet? So, I started as a Twitter account, and it was anonymous, because I was like, I don't know if I need people to know. Right, you know, I just.. I thought that people, because the whole.. the voice I have in it is almost like a really offensive, snobby woman, you know. Yeah, and I've actually toned it down in the last couple of years, because I just.. because the section has evolved, you know, like it used to be, you know, that I was like, if you went to public college, don't try me, you know? Like, and I loved doing that kind of thing, yeah, and calling people like middle class nobody, you know, in the voice of the character, but now it was around 2020 the section really evolved, and I give them credit for evolving, because I mean, and you know, and I like, I, it's so arrogant if I think like, and I think I had a hand in that, but I wonder if enough people thought, oh yeah, this is Snob City USA, yeah, that maybe they said, you know, we need to reevaluate, because they did have an article in 2020 talking about how they sort of changed, yeah, and saying we're really now seeking people interesting stories, yeah. And it is very compelling, you know. Now they'll have, you know, and it runs the gamut from, you know, blue collar couples, like it's just, it's kind of nice, because you just hear different love stories each week, and now there's only about four or five, which, yeah, there's less source material for me, yeah, which makes it hard, but, but, yeah, I mean, I used to, yeah, I used to love playing, sort of like playing games with it, of like, oh, let's, we call a vows hat trick, when it's like a reference to Harvard, reference to the Colony Club, and the Maidstone, you know, there we go, there we go, the triple whammy, exactly. I get what you're saying, and like, I feel like I've also noticed, like, even when there are vows that are just like so heartwarming, where your voice in that account is like, I want to find something to nitpick and make fun of, but I can't, because this is so wonderful, and I'm so happy for the couple, but I think that that's like a fun evolution, right? Like, I thank you. I agree, because I think also, as I get a broader audience, like a couple months ago I gained about a few 1000 followers, yeah, and I just felt like I kind of prefer I'm making jokes about the wedding industrial complex, about wasp culture at large. I don't want to be mean to individual people, and sometimes if you don't really know the references of the snobbery, it can just seem really mean, yeah, and so I've kind of shifted a little bit to try to be a little more like just inclusive or thoughtful of like, you know, not everyone reading this might know like the history of vineyard vines or something, you know, like those weird references, you know, but still maintaining some of the, some of the spice, I know, yeah, there I do enjoy some of the spice still. At this point, you've grown it to over 40,000 followers on Instagram, at least, which is so cool, and it just, it's such a fun community. I think that's another one to what you mentioned earlier, like it's funny, and it's connection, and weddings are something that many people go through, so kind of like, regardless of what your background is, demographics, all of that, like you can relate to it, and you know, we had our big wedding last year, and like it's a whole complex, like it's a, it's a shitstorm, and really wonderful if it works out the way you want, but it's, you know, it's a complex, it's so expensive, so I feel like to your earlier point, like that was just another angle of being able to create that space for people, which is amazing. Have you found that the demographic of followers has shifted a bunch as you've kind of shifted the content to being a little less snarky, maybe, and a little more inclusive? It's a little wider now. Yeah, it used to be almost all women, and which is sort of why I took it from Twitter over to Instagram. So, a friend of mine said she's like, "That's where women are, women are, I know, and that was early on, and when I was building it, because I had a good following on Twitter, and I started building my Instagram, and my friend gave me this great advice. She was like, "That's where women are, especially like younger sorority girls, they, this will resonate with them. She said to me, she goes, people want to see themselves in this, in the joke, and she was like, do two posts a day, and just like, get it going. So, for a while, I was doing a joke on my way to work, and a joke as I left work. Wow, and every day, and I was just like gaining fault. It was just like a steady build. I'm not as consistent now, but also I just don't quite have the push, you know, like I mean I'm happy, and whenever if there's a current event I can make a joke with, I love that, because they almost always resonate, you know, yeah, so that's really fun to play with, or or sometimes I'll just sort of play the hits and reshare old stuff, which is fun, but yeah, it's definitely a broader audience, so I do think the niche references to, like, certain yacht clubs are a little bit lost, so I kind of play it a little more broad. Got it. So then, as that evolved and as this grew, did that account kind of spur other business opportunities for you, or things that you could build on to keep expanding the avenues that you were pursuing? Yes, it was. I remember one, a couple winters ago, when Sami (Sage), who's one of the founders of Betches, followed me, and I was like, I was like, oh my gosh, because I've been wanting to get booked as a guest on Betches Brides. Oh no way, that makes sense. Yeah, I know, like, so I'd been, and I was trying to find a connection in there, but also, I mean, every. Other brother wants to connect with batches, you know, so I didn't have any luck, which I get, but then when Sami followed me, I messaged her almost immediately. I was like, "Hey, I'm a huge fan of all things Betches, you guys are doing such great stuff, so funny. And then we'd built a relationship, so then then I ended up hosting the Betches Brides podcast for about eight months precede, right before and after my wedding. Oh no, it was so wonderful. Yes, because she'd said she was like, we have really good luck, like the audit listenership kind of loves when the host is also planning their own wedding, that makes so much sense. Yeah, because it's just like you're sort of in the trenches with them, you're talking about here's my timeline, I made this decision, so it all.. it just was.. it felt like kismet, you know? That's so beautifully, and I got to connect with so many wonderful people through that, and it was really neat to like go to the Betches office once a week and record there and make good friends over there, and then connect with their listenership and their audience, you know. So that was such a wonderful opportunity that came out of it. And then otherwise some small stuff here or there, nothing like groundbreaking. Yeah, I mean, the Brecht's bride stuff is absolutely amazing, but yeah, but then also some just like fun, friendly connections of people who will be like, 'Hey, I'm in New York, you wanna grab a drink? Yeah, it's kind of fun to like make a new friend through that, right? Right. And back to betches, so yeah, I really admire Betches, and I've been following them for a while, and I've, I've been really interested by some of the interviews they've done about how they've built and how they've stuck with their guns and how they knew what was right for their audience, and that's like that community they were building. So I think it's really cool to be able to like tap into that, especially when you've been doing your own thing for a while, and just see how how other people totally run their stuff. I know it was really neat. I love these stuff they do with brands is so smart and funny, and like some of these young comedy gals who are in their videos are so cool and funny, and I really like those, you know, they're super fun. Like, it's just.. it's neat to see the younger generation of comedians. Yeah, yeah, definitely. So, going back to New York Times, one more question on there, was there one wedding announcement that just like really made you like laugh, cackle, like, have a great reaction, and one that was really so sweet. Well, one, I don't know if you remember a couple years ago, there was a winter wedding, and it was the guy from How I Met Your Mother, Josh Radnor. Oh, yeah, yes, he there, and it was this winter wedding where they.. it was like upstate New York at a campground, I believe, you know, they had like cabins and stuff, yeah, but they did the ceremony outdoors during a snowstorm, right, and it's like that one, it was so, I mean, the photos are sort of shocking because all of the guests are all being snowed on, literally, and then I think a lot of the, I think the band and stuff got like snowed in there, and so is that outrageous, it was just wild. I mean, and it sounded really kind of cozy and cute, but the comments were a lot of fun of people being like, no way. Yeah, it was just because, you know, yes, yeah, yeah, which I mean, and that's it's such a testament to, like, with weddings, you just never know what's gonna happen, and like, the best laid plans always kind of go set, you know, like, it's amazing how much you can plan and do everything right. Oh, I know, and it doesn't turn out the way you wanted it to. I mean, that's that's life. Oh, yeah. Oh, come with a wedding where you're probably spending, someone's spending a lot of money to do it. I know, like, I know the things that you think won't go wrong will, and the things that you really not like it's just this weird kind of Murphy's Law of like the stuff that you generally were worried about will run smoothly, but the stuff that you didn't even see coming will be a weird hiccup. There you know, are you willing to share an example from your own wedding? Oh gosh, great question. Oh, yes. Well, so the night before our wedding, we took all of our guests, we took them on the Staten Island Ferry to go see a baseball game, the minor league Staten Island Ferry Hawks. It was so fun, and we thought, you know, we were going to rent a van to take everyone there, but we thought traffic in New York City on a Friday evening, it's quicker to take a subway, right? So, but we should have done a dry run, like the day before, because these, the one downtown, all of the entrances to get on the one train downtown, these southbound entrances were all closed for construction. I was like, what are the chances, and you know, we had some people who aren't that, you know, like, who have some mobility issues. Yeah, it just getting people from literally 13th Street down to the Staten Island Ferry turned out to be an absolute catastrophe, and like, we did not see that coming. That's a bummer, because I thought, like, oh, we're gonna hop on the one train, it's literally gonna be right here. Yep, and it was, yeah, I mean, people arrived at the Staten Island Ferry, we missed the two to, like, we got to the game late, people were covered in sweat, because we'd been like in the bowels of the subway, like we had to enter on the wrong side and walk around. Yeah, it was like everyone's clammy. I know, yeah, it was like, I know, I was just like, I did not think that all of the downtown entrances to the one would be all shut down, right? At least it was the day before your wedding. I know, yeah, the wedding day itself, well. My, the woman who did my hair was an hour late, which was a little stressful. Yeah, did yours go off without a hitch? For the most part, it was nearly perfect. We, it was end of May in New Jersey, which we were worried the venue did not have any HVAC, so we were nervous it was going to be super hot, and we're like, okay, do we get fans? Like, what did we do? It was 55 and raining, so we did everything inside instead of doing a mix of outside, inside, but that's good. We had the inside plan and had to get creative because we had to have toilet trailers or trailer toilets, and so we had tents. We got tense last minute because we saw that the rain was in the forecast, got tense to connect, like the door to the venue to the toilets. It was a little leaky, but it was a little cold initially, but it made it perfect at the end of the night, when everyone's dancing and sweaty. Exactly, open some windows, and it felt better. So that's great, but yeah, no, we, we were completely preparing for extreme heat, because end of May, you just never know, truly. But this May also was really cold, yeah, like and raining. I know a trend, so I have, I have a joke about wedding porta potties on my stand-up comedy album specific niche. I'm really excited to listen to such a random thing, I love it. Yeah, I was, I was happily surprised with the toilets. They, they were perfectly nice. Oh my gosh, these, some of these porta potties are fantastic. I'm like, I've been to like permanent venues that have had either fewer porta potties, and we only had 60 something people at the wedding, but like we had three stalls for both trailers. Like, yeah, I don't want something to go wrong, like you know, like a clogged toilet will really kill a wedding mood. Yeah, all right. Cool. Well, I'm glad the rest of your wedding went without a hitch. Yeah, going back to how you're, you're building this business, because you're clearly like just getting started. It feels like I feel like you have such runway ahead of you, but you've, you've, you have your stand-up album, which has seen better days on all all the streaming platforms. You've consulted on TV shows, Push Up. Is that the.. was that what the name of the.. what you did on the script? Oh, Punch Up, Punch Up. Yeah, clearly I need to write everything down, or it doesn't get remembered. You've written a book. Or how did you approach getting these gigs? You mentioned you didn't have an agent for all the acting, and that you know you made that happen. How did the other things come about? It's when I look back on my whole career, my time in New York, a lot of them have come just from my own community and the people I've known forever. That's so cool, you know? I mean, it's really because, honestly, like I never had an theatrical agent or manager, and but it really was just from, you know, and so it's so funny because I think it often comes down to who you know, but not in like a yucky way of like who do you know, but you know, a lot of it was from the people that I was doing open mics with in the East Village in the 2010s in 2008 like, and they then you know get opportunities and then they'll think of you and that's why it is just, it's so good to always be like a hard worker, known as someone who's just like dependable, that you can execute, you can really get things done, and even like just a good hang, like you know, like it is a very important part of it, if you're gonna go, you know, we used to go like for weekends and film videos, like in the woods, and you need people who like you can be in a four hour car ride with, and then yeah, you're all on set filming together, and you know, kicking around ideas, but yeah, it struck me as I look back how much it's all just through connections that I've built over the years, just with being in the mix and in the scene, you know, like my standup album was produced by Sonali Bomac and Jason Lamb, and they have their own production company for comedians, and they give you a really great cut, and I've just.. and I just knew Sonali through Friends, right? And so then in 2017 I was like, oh, you know, I at that point I'd been doing stand-up, you know, maybe 10 years or a little more, and I felt like I need to.. I want to do an album to have some of my favorite jokes sort of recorded and set, you know, which I'm so glad I did that album, because then a couple years later I stepped away from stand-up, but I felt like I feel okay stepping away from it, because I have this amazing show and it's recorded on this album, and I made good money off of it. Yeah. Oh, that's great, like to your point, like, you know, you were talking earlier about, you know, having a job, and so that you can focus on the craft, but the fact that your craft could then one be immortalized, and I think that's really special to immortalize a lot of different moments in your life. So, I think that's great. And then to make money off of it, like that's amazing. Oh, I know, I know, I say that was like, you know, I agree with what Elizabeth Gilbert says in Big Magic, like, you shouldn't demand the art pay for your life, but sometimes your art takes you to, you know, a trip to Aruba, and it pays for it. That's pretty sweet, and we love that. I'll take it. We'll take it. I like that you talk about relationships, because the theme of this season of this podcast for me is building things, cool people building meaningful things, and a theme that is emerging with a lot of these conversations is that human connection, that those relationships. Ships and what across industries, and I think that's something that I wonder how that will evolve with, like, today's younger generation, because I think you know, I was, I'm, I was born in 1991 and so kind of got the beginning of social media, but had had the landline, right, like we had to call friends home, like we had to build those interpersonal relationships. Do you have any insight as to younger generations of comics, or, you know, in the writing scene, or like it? Do you see anything that maybe you would like, not caution necessarily, but give advice to maybe younger people coming up for some of those soft skills that were clearly so fruitful for you. I think it's such a good question, because it is such a different landscape, right? And I worry it does seem like some of these young people who are on Instagram, and you know, posting a lot, and are going, you know, have solid reels consistently, you know, they do seem to have an instinct to collab with others and connect, and I think that's really important. Yeah, but it needs to, I think to me, it's always so yucky when you can tell it's sort of a like deliberate brand collab, but it's not an organic, you know, like it's not quite a fit, but because it's about more than a collab, it's about trying to build a friendship that 10 years down the road, if one of you gets staffed on a TV show, you might think of your old buddy, you know, who you did a project with 10 years prior, but it, it needs to sort of be a real friendship and a real connection, and I think people can kind of smell it when it's not, and I think that's a real turnoff to viewers and audience when it feels like, oh, this is opportunism on both sides, so yeah, I think it's important to sort of do what truly works for you, and, and I think that's probably harder and harder today. Yeah, you know, like back when I was coming up, there weren't, you know, you know, you worked with people you wanted to work with, because you're all working kind of a failing business, you know, like you're just like, do you want to make a video, and we'll stick it, maybe on YouTube at best. Yeah, but now there's just so much more opportunity, but I think with that comes a lot of danger of losing sight of what do you want and what's your style and what's your goal, you know? Because it doesn't have to be the same as everyone's. We're going to take a quick break, and we'll be right back, I We are back on If I'm Honest with Julia Landauer, and I think kind of something else that made me think of was, you know, now tools for creating, especially video content, or stuff to show, showcase your work, or you know, just the very art of creating engaging short-form videos, like, like a TikTok, like Instagram Reels, whatever it is. Those tools are a lot more accessible now, so a lot more people can create, but creating takes time, like so many people I feel like, who are building their business around a craft, are are then putting in all the hours in post production and making that, and like, I wonder if that is kind of like a double-edged sword that so many people can put stuff out there, but does that then isolate a little bit more? Does it? I'm not sure, and I think there's not a perception. I think the average person doesn't realize how much time it takes, so yeah, I mean, I think people think podcasts fall out of the sky, you know, it's like, I mean, but it's so much time with, like, cooking, preparation, reserving, you know, like editing, I mean, everything, but I think sometimes people get the finished, finished product, and you know, there's a perception that it's effortless, yeah, you know, which, and as it sort of should be, but I mean, that was how I felt with stand-up, a lot, like, you know, it looks like it's easy, it looks like you're well, I'm just having conversation with the audience, but it's a skill that you learn in 10 minute increments of like grinding every night in different comedy clubs and different venues, and so I mean one thing, and this is kind of a left turn, but I do think sometimes when I'll see young people on TikTok or Instagram and they sort of fancy themselves comedians, you know, I'm like, yeah, okay, you're making videos, that's cool, but stand up to do 45 minutes of stand up is a very different thing, and you know, like you hear about people trying to go out on tour and having maybe 10 minutes, you know, but like being expected to headline because they're a big draw, yeah, they don't really have much, you know, so, and being on stage, and I think also, and a few of my guests have also been keynote speakers, like me, and like we've talked about how comedians and stand-up comics have influenced how we deliver keynotes, because it is like that balance of important message that you're driving home with humor and keeping the audience engaged, like it is really hard to keep an audience engaged for a long time, and I think especially you never know what kind of audience you're going to get, and so I remember, I remember the first keynote I gave, where the audience was not feeling it, and it was so distracting for me, and I was like, "Shit, I need to, I need to make sure that my delivery is good, so that even if it's not a great audience or engaging audience, like, I know I'm. Delivering the best that I can, and it's a, it's just a very different skill set. Like, I'm really good on stage, I'm terrible with video production. Shout out to Emmie Leary, who does my videos for this, because I can't do that. I don't know what I mean. I know what I like watching, I can't, that's not a strength that I have. And so, kudos to people who are trying to, like, you know, combine some different things, but they are.. it's kind of like what gets you the attention is kind of far from the craft, and makes you really appreciate the people who do both really well. Oh, completely. I know. Yeah, I mean, we used to bellyache a lot, that like I didn't get into stand-up to be, you know, building a website, yeah. But, but all of these are sort of necessary pieces to it, and like, can you farm it out to someone? Can somebody help you do it, or can you trade skills of, like, you're not good at, you know, you need me to copy edit your website, and you build mine or something. Yeah, yeah, no, totally. And I think that's in a lot of, lot of crafts, a lot of industries, like, so much of your time spent is not necessarily on the craft itself, because you need all these other, sorry, you need all these other things to work to be able to continue doing it, totally, and it's, it can be a little disheartening sometimes. Yeah, so what made you step away from stand-up? Ah, it kind of stopped being fun. There we go, I know, and I always said I will stop when this stops being fun. I released my album that I'm so proud of, and a good friend of mine passed away. Thank you. About when I recorded the album in July 2017 and my good friend Jenny died in August 2017 And after that, I just.. I don't know, it just made me think of things differently, and I just felt like, you know, what I love that I did stand up for all this time. It was such a valuable time. It was such a wonderful era in my life. It was so magical, but I don't know if after working nine to five or nine to six, if I want to go to a dank basement in the East Village to, you know, be like work grinding out certain jokes, you know? I just, I don't know, it kind of made me realize, like, life is short, and I, I'm so proud of my stand-up era, but I think I was ready for that to be kind of done, and then, and then, incidentally, I met the man who's now my husband, and you know, and I just felt like, if I have a free night, I kind of want to spend it with this guy, yeah, yeah, so I mean, but it was such a wonderful time, and I don't think it was wasted time just because I got to where I got, and that's as far as I got. Well, and you can't look at your life now and assume that you would be here if any of the prior pieces had not exactly been placed the way they were, like you place them the way they were. Was it a bittersweet step away, or did you have conviction like this is no longer for me? Like, do you miss it? Like, it's funny, I didn't miss it at all until just recently. I just thought of, because sometimes you'll think of something, and you know, and I'll be like, God, if I were still doing stand-up, I could talk about this on stage tonight, you know. And like, there's such a fun.. there's such a beauty in having a fun, fresh idea, maybe something topical, and being like, oh my god, I could explore this on stage tonight, and you know, I can't do that anymore. I mean, although my good friend Katie Compa, who runs a great show at QED in Astoria, she's always like, 'Come back anytime you want, you know. So, so I might have a guest appearance at some point, maybe. No, part of me, it's like, should I do one night only? I'm back, you know. But, yeah, so you know it's bittersweet at times, but also, I mean, not really. Like, I don't miss the grind, yeah. No, I get that. Do you keep a bank of like, when you have these ideas, do you jot them down or do you record them or something? Yeah, I record them or I jot them down. I have like a running Word doc of a ton of like random ideas. And then one, I was walking the other day and I had this idea, so I just like I did an audio recording on my phone. Yeah, no, that's great. I feel like if nothing else, like it's fun to look back and like see how your brain was working, and who knows, like maybe later there will be something that comes of it, exactly. And what an idea could be used for, you know? You just never know, but so it's good to just like tally all these down, because you never know. Yeah, would you do writing like, is there a lot of, like, I don't want to say ghost writing, but I think, like, that from books, like, do you, is it the same thing in the comedy scene, or in other avenues that you would do. I actually did have an opportunity to ghost write a book for some people from The Bachelor years ago, which was wild. And so I did interviews with them. It was really neat. It didn't end up going well, because then we shopped around a book proposal for it. The ghost writing opportunity, I felt like made total sense, because, like, I work in publishing, I wrote a book myself, but I also am obsessed. I was obsessed with The Bachelor, and I do comedy, you know. So, I just.. it kind of.. but again, it sort of fell in my lap through people I knew, you know, which I mean, just sort of lucky breaks. But so, kind of going to like things that we've learned, and then we're gonna.. we're gonna get into our final segment. But was there ever a project that you were like convinced was gonna be the best thing ever, and either it didn't go as you hoped, or you had to like pivot and rebound, but then were really pleased with how it ended up. It's so funny, like, I, this is how that is exactly how I feel about my book. Okay, yeah, so in 2013 I published a book called The New Rules for Blondes. It was within an imprint within HarperCollins, which I was like, HarperCollins, huge, you know. And, and I was so, you know, one of my good friends was my literary agent and repped me, and the editor, they sort of cooked up the idea of it. And then my good friend, who's a literary agent, she directed this editor at HarperCollins to my website, and I was writing, you know, just blogging about The Bachelor for fun, and this was back - this was sort of probably the last time when you could, like, get a book deal from, like, an impressive blog, which, like, that used to happen in the early aughts, but so the three of us met, and sort of, the, she said, you know, my imprint, I think, would love to do a book that's sort of funny, and it's essays about being blonde and really like light and fun, and you know, and I on in my blog, I would sort of brag about my hair and being blonde and that kind of thing, so it all, you know, it worked nicely, and so it seemed very promising, and I was so excited. It was a ton of work, in addition to my nine to five, you know, like I kind of went into hermit mode, like all my friends knew, like Selena can't hang out, because at night and on weekends I was writing this book, and then it came out, and it got almost no press, like to the point that a friend of friends of mine in media literally were like, 'Did your publisher even send out galleys? like it didn't even see, yeah, like any press that I got, I just got through like friends and contacts that I had it. The whole experience was such a disappointment, to the point where it was almost embarrassing when people would like bring it up, and I did like a live event at the Harvard Coop, and like a drunk homeless person literally, like it was. I mean, now it's like hilarious, but literally heckled me as I was trying to do a reading of the book, and there was like no security there, like I felt a little bit thrown off by that. Yeah, like it just.. I just felt like it was sort of humiliation after humiliation, and so it was so disappointing because it had taken so much time. But what I realized, actually, in preparing for this podcast was right after that was when I created @NYTVows, and yeah, and I think it was because I was, I just been swimming in blonde jokes and blonde content. I was so sort of tired of that lane, and I was like, you know what, Twitter's easy. I can't believe no one's making fun of the New York Times weddings. Actually, I'm gonna do it, and I can just crank out jokes, and it'll just be light and fun, and it's not as intense as this book project that felt like sort of Sisyphean, and it then it also didn't do well, you know, like it was so so it did lead me into doing other things that were a little lighter and more fun. Yeah, and Selena, it goes right back to what you're saying about acting, that there's so much out of your control with publishing, like there's so many elements, I mean, I've never written a book or published one, and there's so, but there's so many elements that you need to rely on other people for, and again, could have done everything perfectly, and oh, wow, what a theme that's going through your life, oh my goodness, it really is, yeah, it's really, it's just, I mean, I truly think you got to make your own breaks, and usually those are the ones that will, you know, like even if the gatekeepers do let you in, yeah, often it's not even the best, and the things that you build yourself will always feel more rewarding, yeah, and more exciting, yeah. So, on that note, before we go to the last segment, are there any things that you'd be comfortable sharing that you still want to do from a creative perspective. Well, I have been working on for about a year and a half. I've been writing with this wonderful writer who has her master's in screenwriting, Maria Carolan, and we meet up and drink wine, and we turned @NYTVows into like a sitcom concept. I know, so we made, we mapped out what will happen in the first season, you know. Will happen, we wrote the, we wrote the pilot, and then mapped out the sort of story arcs for the first season, ideally story arcs for subsequent seasons. I sent it to a friend of mine in LA, who is in the business, and so she gave us some really good notes. So that's been really fun, and it's been fun to collaborate with someone else, and not just be doing it all myself, you know, but so, so, Maria and I, we wrote this stuff, and we're a little bit taking a beat right now, but I think I hope that we can kind of keep expanding that and playing with it. So that's been just a fun writing project, and if nothing comes of it, whatever, it's still fun project, exactly. It's just a fun creative outlet. We here believe in manifesting, so hopefully this, this at some point brings it to speak it into existence. Yeah, exactly. Oh, that's exciting. Yeah, it's been really fun, and I mean it's ripe for, you know, just sort of the story of it's kind of my story of the story of a single woman reading the section, living in New York, making fun of the section, and eventually, you know, I mean, it's not even about her getting into the section, but just her sort of having her own dating life, and then also reading this every Sunday about other people falling in love, and sort of feeling kind of torn about that, you know. I am manifesting this so hard, I would love to watch that. Thank you for sharing that. So, to get two more segments for this next one, I. Helping other people shine, so that's wonderful. You can see that, yeah, and that leaves such an impact on the people that you're engaging with, right? Like that. Oh, that's great. It was a really nice to be seen. That's awesome. Last, if you're honest, what's something that you're grateful for right now? Just simple stuff. I just appreciate having my health. Yeah, I appreciate. I love living in New York. I like that I could ride the subway and go to magical places that are like that. People travel from around the world to come here, and I feel so lucky that if I want to, I can just go ride on a ferry on the East River for fun, and it's four bucks. Yeah, you know, I really have leaned into simple pleasures in the past couple years, and I just, you know, life is a miracle, and I can't believe that I get to even experience it. Oh my gosh, that is such a beautiful way to end this conversation, because I think that's so true, and like little joys and appreciation for life, and it is so precious, and we're not guaranteed anything, and so it's a really great reminder. So, thank you for sharing that. We will link everything in the description, but where would you like people to find you? Well, of course, they can find me @NYTvows on Instagram, literally N Y T V O W S. It's also still on Twitter X, but we have most, we have the most fun on Instagram. And then my personal insta, I think it's a lot of fun, it's just my life, but it's just @SelenaCoppock at S E L E N A C O P P O C K. And then my album is on iTunes and Spotify, and all those fun places, Seen Better Days, and it's my artistic output that I am the most proud of of anything I've ever made. I love that. Yeah, and we will share it widely. Selena, thank you so much for joining us and being honest with us team. Thank you for joining us on If I'm Honest with Julia Landauer. I hope you enjoyed listening to this conversation as much as I enjoyed recording it with our guest. And if you liked the episode, please subscribe to the podcast on your preferred platform to get new episodes when they drop. It would also be a huge help if you can leave a rating on that page, write a comment, and share the episode with someone who you think might enjoy it. As always, thank you for letting us be honest with you, and I'll see you next week.